The Grand Challengers Podcast Episode #38
The human side of planning and flood risk in London – the challenge of embedding history into policy
Guest: Patricia Cuervo Uría
January 28th, 2025
Episode Teaser
Introduction
“…there are limits to what planning can do and we need to follow the rules…”
Patri Cuervo is a Regional Delivery Manager at Binnies in the UK. Patri is a chartered planner and a fellow member of the Chartered Institution of Water and Environmental Management (or CIWEM for short). She has over 18 years of experience in delivering local government services in central London and has extensively worked in flood risk and drainage policy development and implementation. Her journey to date comprises many hats that she has worn in practice, from local government to consulting and a diverse portfolio of water projects, where she has actively embraced stakeholder engagement in shaping policy and emergency situations.
On today’s show, Patri and I look into London’s history with water and flood risk and retrace the planning policies and projects she has worked on across her career to date, highlighting the invaluable contribution of openness and transparency with stakeholders. We discuss the potential and limits of planning and the urgency for better mental health support in the face of climate change.
Biography
Patricia Cuervo Uría is a Regional Delivery Manager at Binnies with over 21 years of experience in flood risk and drainage policy development, urban planning, and infrastructure management. She has managed key projects, including the Thames Tideway Tunnel and the Counters Creek storm alleviation scheme. Patricia’s academic background includes a BSc in Biology from the University of Oviedo, an MSc in Geography from King’s College London, and an MSc in Planning from Oxford Brookes University. She is a Chartered Member of the Royal Town Planning Institute and a Fellow of the Chartered Institute of Water and Environmental Management.
Before joining Binnies, Patricia spent 18 years at the Royal Borough of Kensington and Chelsea, where she specialized in planning policy and flood risk management. She played a central role in establishing the borough’s Lead Local Flood Authority responsibilities and led projects such as the development of sustainable drainage systems, the local flood risk management strategy, and responses to significant infrastructure projects. Her work included engaging with residents, businesses, and stakeholders to address public concerns and support policy implementation. Patricia also co-chaired the London Drainage Engineers Group, contributing to regional policy coordination and the advancement of best practices in water management.
Resources Related to the Episode
- London Tourist Walks
- Walking tours [TripAdvisor]
- Bridges along The Thames and Chelsea Bridge in particular
- King’s College in London
- We know each other through Luis Sanudo, who’s been on the show. Check out Episode 32 with Luis to hear his story and more info about Oviedo in Asturia, Spain
- The Royal Borough of Kensington & Chelsea Official Website
- The 2007 Floods in England
- Lead Local Flood Authorities in London (LLFA) and more on flood risk management including some of the terminology Patri mentioned
- London’s Sewer System
- History of London’s sewers and further details from the Institution of Civil Engineers
- The Lost Rivers of London
- A 101 on Flood Risk and return periods
- Forgetting flood events: I remember reading some interesting article about forgetting flood event over time:
- Atreya, A., Ferreira, S. and Kriesel, W., 2013. Forgetting the flood? An analysis of the flood risk discount over time. Land economics, 89(4), pp.577-596. [Link]
- Fanta, V., Šálek, M. and Sklenicka, P., 2019. How long do floods throughout the millennium remain in the collective memory?. Nature communications, 10(1), p.1105. [Link]
- The October 2024 Valencia Floods
- About the floods and a bird’s eye view
- Patri’s article will be made available here once published, so keep a look out!
- A video highlighting the emergency response with volunteers using brooms
- Nationally Significant Infrastructure Projects (NSIPs) in the UK
- A list of NSIPs across the UK (a searchable database of projects)
- The Thames Tideway Tunnels Project
- Tideway’s Official Website
- The RB Kensington and Chelsea section of the Tideway Tunnel Project Page
- The Chelsea Embankment Site
- The Tideway Tunnel Cremorne Wharf Site
- Our discussion on SuDS
- The Greening SPD
- CIRIA’s SuDS Manual and Blue Roof Guidance
- The Counters Creek Project
- The Portobello Court SuDS Project
- The Royal Borough of Kensington and Chelsea SuDS Planning Policy
- More on the Grenfell Tower Fire
- More on the London Bombings of 2005
- The London 2021 Flooding
- About the flood event
- The Review Document by Thames Water
- Drainage and Wastewater Management Plan Appendix P
- Mental Health Topics
- General Mental Health
- Behavioral health following disaster or emergencies
- WHO’s article calling for coordinated and effective mental health response in emergencies
- Book recommendations from the episode:
- “The Boy, The Mole, The Fox and The Horse” by Mackesy, Charlie [View on Amazon]
- “Many Lives, Many Masters: The true story of a prominent psychiatrist, his young patient and the past-life therapy that changed both their lives” by Dr. Brian weiss [View on Amazon]
- “Less is more” by Jason Hickel [View on Amazon]
Episode Chapters
(Chapters are embedded in the episode for quick access, click this to expand and view all chapters and time stamps)
- 0:00 Intro
- 1:59 Guest Intro and a London Walk
- 5:07 From Biology to Planning
- 13:37 London’s Water in Context
- 15:46 Flooding and Flood Risk in London
- 23:26 The Thames Tideway Tunnels
- 29:46 Stakeholder Involvement in Planning
- 36:30 From city council to consulting – a change of hats
- 39:37 What about SuDS?
- 47:48 Empowerment from the Grenfell Tower Fire
- 56:15 Mental health and climate change
- 1:00:09 Patri’s current endeavours
- 1:04:06 Q&A Start
- 1:04:54 What is innovation?
- 1:06:32 Key Event, Book person
- 1:09:22 If you had a magic wand?
- 1:10:50 Time management
- 1:12:44 Favourite childhood memory
- 1:14:43 Advice for young professionals
- 1:16:48 What would you like to be remembered for?
- 1:19:21 Where can people reach you?
- 1:20:05 Final Message
- 1:20:39 Outro
Connect with Patricia Cuervo Uría
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Credits
- Hosted by Peter Marcus Bach, follow me on: X: @petermbach, Instagram: @petermbach87 or subscribe to my channel on YouTube: www.youtube.com/c/PeterMarcusBach/
- Intro/Outro Song: ‘Starsky’ by Alex Keren (Check out more of his tunes over on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/artist/5vZ3lENfDLjkln8scBJ8mW)